kbuc
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| 05/04/2008 7:05 AM |
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So what length check cords does everyone use, and why?
I see them ranging usually between 15 to 20 feet. Any pros or cons between the two?
Years back while traing my dog to sit on a blind retreive, I was taught to use a 50'+ cord. That way, you can adjust the distance from you.
I have a 100' section that I'm going to cut up into various lengths. What do you more experienced guys think would be good sizes? |
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Huntin_Fool01
Oldham, South Dakota
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| 05/06/2008 8:05 PM |
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| I dont know much about training but I would think more is better. You can always bunch it up to shortten it for different uses. |
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dunt
Aumsville, Oregon
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| 05/06/2008 8:24 PM |
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Kbuc, I am new to training and working on my first dog. I use a 30 foot rope. It works good for me.
Tim |
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keskam
Pierce, Colorado
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| 05/07/2008 6:34 AM |
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| I alos like a 30 ft CC , 50 ft is long for me, and I also like a really light CC small in diameter so the dog can work good in the field with it! |
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kbuc
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| 05/09/2008 12:21 PM |
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| Since I have the rope, I'll just do a 50, 30, and a 20 for good measure. That'll give me options. |
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staunch
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| 06/03/2008 9:04 AM |
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| Some people don't use check cords.......... |
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Rob G
Cedaredge, CO
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| 06/03/2008 11:07 AM |
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| A 20ft. works fine for all of my yard work...any longer and I step all over it and constantly have to untangle it. |
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oakcreeklabs
Moundridge Kansas
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| 06/04/2008 10:38 AM |
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| 12ft, I guess for retriever drills a longer one might be necissary |
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VicR
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| 06/04/2008 1:31 PM |
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I can think of two reasons  "why" people use them, but I would like to see someone explain the reasoning and end results.
Thanks! |
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keskam
Pierce, Colorado
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| 06/04/2008 2:00 PM |
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 I use it to help steady the dog! once he is on point I pick the cord up and watch for a small backwards movement in the hind legs, when I se it I give alittle tug and the dog refocuses and holds point longer and longer without saying WHOA!! If Jake goes out 250 yards and goes on point, you are not going to hear me hollering WHOA! |
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Liv2Hnt
Overland Park, KS
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| 06/04/2008 2:40 PM |
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| I cant even imagine how one would go about training a dog without a check chord, especially when they are young. Even at 2 years old, I occassionally throw the check chord and chain collar on my dog. Keeps them honest, even without the collar pressure, I can still put pressure on the dog for here sit, heel etc. To me a check chord is an essential tool in my non-pro dog training toolbox. In the upland, most of my experience came from pointing breeds, and again it was an essential steady on point and to help work steady to flush and shot. As an answer to your question on length, I use a 100' especially on a young dog to make sure you get a response to here every time, a 30' for back yard work and I have a couple of shorter tabs/leash length as well. Im not saying you cant train a dog for obediance and field work without one, but I really wouldnt want to try. |
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Rob G
Cedaredge, CO
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| 06/04/2008 3:40 PM |
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I can't imagine someone not using a check cord at all. About all of my yard work is performed with a check cord on the dog. How else can you maintain control at a distance anywhere further from your side? OB, FF, CC are all performed with a check cord on the dog.
When I'm working in the fields, I will put a check cord on a young dog (especially one that tends to blow off early OB), so that I can step on it when they decide to blow me off.
I don't use a check cord for a dog on point. Only to maintain control and OB.
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keskam
Pierce, Colorado
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| 06/04/2008 3:53 PM |
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Posted By VicR on 06/04/2008 1:31 PM I do not use check cords, I know others do. From the responses I see "what" people are using. I can think of two reasons "why" people use them, but I would like to see someone explain the reasoning and end results. Thanks!
1.remote sit. 2 here. 3 pile work. 4 steadying. 5 from FF through pile work they are on the Check cord! Kevin |
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VicR
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| 06/04/2008 5:36 PM |
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Thanks!
Well, come to think of it everyone, yes, I remember now. I do use a check cord during the younger years during training. It's just been a while. Just getting old I guess. 
But I remember correctly I haven't used them on upland.
The bird just flies away if they do not point. Might take longer and more birds but I like the "au natural" point I guess. No holding back. Go flush the bird if you desire, but no reward for you! The point comes out if they have it.
I do whoa training to re-inforce the time on point.
But, I'm not steadfast one way or another.
I'll have to research further. Have a new pup to train.
Where did the check cord concept originate?
Any cons to using the check cord while training in upland?
I'm assuming that would be answered by non-check cord trainers because all check cord users have already made a decision (in upland).
It would be really beneficial if some check cord users can tell me the pros and cons to doing so.
Thanks!
Vic |
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keskam
Pierce, Colorado
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| 06/04/2008 6:09 PM |
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| Vic, It is on the younger dogs in the upland, if they flush it it flies too! but when they go on point I pick it up and steady them and teach them that somebody will flush the bird(not them)then you will sit until I release you! I think it comes in real handy right there! not a whole lot of pressure to inforce steady to wing and shot! Kevin |
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Liv2Hnt
Overland Park, KS
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| 06/04/2008 7:15 PM |
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| Yead Id reiterate what kevin says, the check chord has nothing to do with the point, which is still "au natural" just gives you some additional control on other ob issues. We worked all our setters on rope and you wont get any naysayers about their pointing ability. We also used cleats in the ground to maintain control on whoa and steady to flush. Im my opinion, both of these are trained and have nothing to do wtih the point in a dog. Im sure the pros of the group can expand. |
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Liv2Hnt
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| 06/04/2008 7:54 PM |
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| On a second note, Ive seen some dogs point and never even want to move a muscle, both my last pl and some setter we had. However, in my limited experience 10-12 dogs, Id say most need plenty of time on birds to learn manners on point. It is not your job to get the bird after you establish point. |
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VicR
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| 06/05/2008 4:16 PM |
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Can't you flush the bird without a check cord on a dog?
If they want to pick it up, why not let them try?
(If you have good flyer's they can't pick it up).
Steadiness to wing and shot is a little different I think. And I see it described here as a way to steady the dog on point, not to hold a dog back from chasing a bird after it flushes (which sounds logical). During training I see people holding back a dog that established a point from flushing the bird. So it does have to do with point, no? Not establishing the point, but holding it.
Isn't it better to let the dog learn he can't have the bird by letting it fly away rather than holding him back?
I'm not so sure the use is is more for OB issues versus the willingness to point and hold it naturally for "a while".
Maybe it is the degree of "pountiness" we are a talking about. I mean even other breeds of pointing dogs will eventually run in on a pointed bird if not trained properly.
I think eventually you need to re-inforce the hold on a point, whether it be a check cord or the whoa command.
But I see it being used on puppies/dogs under 6 months old that have hunted up less than 50 birds.
Do you recommend the use of a check cord on the first upland outing to steady a puppy if he happens to point?
No negatives whatsoever to using a check cord? At the very least it slows the dog down a little in the upland field.
Any published references to where you got the check cord training method for upland? I mean, where did this originate?
Please don't view this as an attack on your training methods. I am sure it works. I am just wondering what is "better".
Thanks for the info, it is very helpful.
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2Blackdogs!
Kansas City Area - GO CHIEFS !!!
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| 06/05/2008 5:26 PM |
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| Whats better is what works for you and the particular dog at the moment. We started out at 9 weeks of age taking the walk with a very light weight rope about 10 to 15' long tied to the collar so he would get used to it being there and maybe even associate it with fun stuff. Kept doing that till delivering to trainer at 7.5 mo old. Gave me a sense of comfort at least thinking it might help me catch the little bugger if I needed to! Couple times I did even walk up to him stepping on that rope the whole way while on point. This was especially helpful when the suposedly planted bird was actually walking around flippin' us both off. A young dog-heck any dog will sometimes only take so much of that! |
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keskam
Pierce, Colorado
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| 06/05/2008 7:01 PM |
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| Vic, You can teach WHOA and when the dog is on point say whoa and freeze him, and there are other ways to, but I like to try and say nothing, therefore the use of the CC comes in handy for me! Like I said when we do real hunting and jake is way out on a bird on point I dont say anything! Just go up kick it up and send him for the retrieve! I try to do things the same way every time! The dog can count on it! Kevin |
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HR Rocky Mountain Rosco JH
APR HR Lady Satin of Black Forest JH
SHR Satin's Jumpin Jedi JH
SHR Chelsea Snow Angel JH
APR HR KB's Snakey Jake of Poudre River JH
SHR KB's It's Showtime of Bearpoint (Star)
SHR KB's Loaded To Go Allie
KB's Black Diamond Tessa |
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