Posted By chrissmith1313 on 08 Feb 2010 03:53 PM
  I agree with others on this forum that said don't pick the kennel.  Pick the parents. Wacth both the parents work and hunt. Watch pups of those two parents work and hunt would even be better. There are many good litters out there these days in all price ranges.  You are doing the right thing by completing your research in advance so you can make an "informed decision".   Good luck with your research!

Posted By micahd on 09 Feb 2010 06:24 PM
First of all welcome! You have found a resource of people and a wealth of information on here to help on your journey into the Pointing Lab world. I do have a couple of recommendations for you as well. Attend an APLA event and also look into the HRC events and the AKC hunt tests and Field Trials. The APLA events dont take place quite as frequently as the others do. Also look at gunclub labradors and order Julies book, Training the Pointing Labrador. There is a difference in how you train a pointing lab versus a flushing lab and this will help. My next point is HUGE. go to kennels, breeders etc and look at parents only. You will find out soon enough that Labradors do not make ugly puppies. Dont even go look at a litter unless its one you would consider buying from. Otherwise that emotion and the eagerness to get started on a Dog will kick in. Most of all have fun and ask all the questions on here you can. Good Luck!!

Well stated   I hope to visit a couple of kennels this week and promise NOT to look at puppies.  Also discovered that my neighbor is AKC Field Trial judge and on Board of local retriever club.  His advice..."watch the "bitches" the males all seem quite good but much of the time the females are the weak link...hold out for strong pedigrees on both sides of the litter."  I have to admit that after he said that I have noticed that often the female is the weak link in the genetics of the litter.  Thanks...TomCat...also looking at the South Dakota hunt test in May...

Posted By OD on 24 Feb 2010 03:22 PM
The fermales are almost always the weak link. They are also the ones that will have th greatest infl;ucne on the genetics.



This is just not true.  Genes come 50% from the male and 50% from the female-neither has a greater influence than the other. 

Many females are less titled-but often not because of less ability.  They aren't campaigned as hard-because they come into heat and people want to breed pups.  They spend lots more time with the pups than the sires do-often the sires never see their pups.  If pups and dams are together in the field-who knows how much the pups learn from their moms?  I know people who believe hunting a pregnant bitch has a positive influence on the pups.  Sires produce lots of pups-some are great, some are not.  Very, very few sires produce noteworthy pups regardless of who they are bred to.  Dams, though, can produce litters with notably good dogs in each-even when they are bred to a different sire each time.  In the cutting horse world, a great deal of importance is placed on the dam's lineage, quality and her ability.  Foals from a dam who is herself a winner are more valued than those from a dam who is not.  I think there would be an increase in the quality and abilities of PL pups if more people trained and showed their bitches to higher levels-and only bred the really good ones based on performance instead of what's on paper.

Posted By OD on 24 Feb 2010 06:53 PM

I have seen Sires that consistently produce good litters. Few but they are out there. Most are not the ones you hear about in advertising or have been bred the most. You will find them from the people that are breeding to produce a better dog and not driven by profit.
AGREE,,,but,probably naively,I WOULD HOPE THAT THE ONES BEING BRED THE MOST ARE THE CREAM OF THE CROP,the high budget marketing and upper price range pups the best of the best?????
One of the best dogs I have ever worked with is hunted only. How can you know your dogs ability if it is not developed and tested?

Gary

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Posted By gum on 25 Feb 2010 04:53 PM
This is something I heard a long time ago from my mentor who still trains weekly with me. He has produced 2 FCs and been in the game over 50 years and is still throwing birds at 74. I think it is kinda cute. Your field trial dogs are your pro baseball players and your hunt test dogs are your AA players and your hunting dogs are your beer league softball players. It takes a pretty poor dog to not be a good hunting dog. That is why we have tests because there is a big swing of the pendulum from what one person thinks is a good hunting dog and what the other guy thinks. Just food for thought.

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