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saulk river pup
Last Post 19 Sep 2010 05:24 PM by Jere. 20 Replies.
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rangerUser is Offline
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13 Nov 2006 08:53 AM  
I purchased a so-called pointing lab pup from a kennel in Kansas city, the pup is a son to saulk river featherstorm Jake and female named Good golly miss molly II. The dog is almost a year old he knows sit,heal,some basic whistle commands and learnes quickly, but in the field he shows no signs of pointing and shows no interest or drive to hunt!! I am very disappointed in this male. I have had labs my whole life and have never seen one that shows no interest like this one. Has anyone owned a dog out of the breeding and had problems. also what would be a suggestion on training with this dog.

  
Rob GUser is Offline
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Cedaredge, CO

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13 Nov 2006 09:23 AM  

Some dogs show point later than others.

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13 Nov 2006 09:05 PM  
Posted By ranger on 11/13/2006 8:53 AM
I purchased a so-called pointing lab pup from a kennel in Kansas city, the pup is a son to saulk river featherstorm Jake and female named Good golly miss molly II. The dog is almost a year old he knows sit,heal,some basic whistle commands and learnes quickly, but in the field he shows no signs of pointing and shows no interest or drive to hunt!! I am very disappointed in this male. I have had labs my whole life and have never seen one that shows no interest like this one. Has anyone owned a dog out of the breeding and had problems. also what would be a suggestion on training with this dog.

  
It's very difficult to believe this pup actually exists.  I don't think I've ever seen a dog that was even part Labrador that showed "no interest or drive to hunt".

On the odd chance that you're telling the truth, you'd probably have better luck bringing this up with the breeder of the litter, & asking for a refund rather than whining on here.

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N.E. WA state

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14 Nov 2006 10:25 AM  
Might be the dog -- Might be the trainer or training program.



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New Boston, MI

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14 Nov 2006 12:20 PM  
I find this hard to believe too. In the General section you are looking for a pointing pup.
If the breeding is there, It is up to you to work with it

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14 Nov 2006 02:24 PM  
2 siblings of your pup passed their CPR's in Colorado this year....that tends to tell me the litter was a good one...unfortunetly not every pup in every litter is going to accomplish what its siblings do... I've had the pleasure several times to watch Sauk River Featherstorm (Jake) in the bird field...the dog is absolutely amazing...as are many of his offspring that I have also had the pleasure to shoot birds over...Molly is a proven producer...and what I've been told a great pointer...thou I've never seen her in the bird field...

As dannoj said above..maybe it would be benificial to contact the person who sold you the pup...

good luck with your pup...it still may turn around to be everything you want in a pointing lab....

Black Angus Featherstorm, "Angus"

AKC Reg Number: SR22883508

DOB: 1/5/2005 Sex: M

Sire: Sauk River's Featherstorm

Dam: HPK's Good Golly Miss Molly II

Owner: Christopher Pfanstiel

Handler: Christopher Pfanstiel

Amazing Grace of Sauk River, "Grace"

AKC Reg Number: SR22883502

DOB: 1/5/2005 Sex: F

Sire: Sauk River's Featherstorm

Dam: HPK's Good Golly Miss Molly II

Owner: Todd Sadler

Handler: Todd Sadler


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14 Nov 2006 09:12 PM  
"I am very disappointed in this male."

If the two pups listed above were from his litter...  I'm guessing he's very disappointed in you as well! 

sorry, couldn't resist!

I've never been a believer in the "make sure to pick the right pup from the litter" approach.  Just my opinion, but I think if you pick the right litter, the pups are pretty much the same.  I can't believe they'd range from spectacular, to a total dud who has no interest in hunting.    (unless something very wrong happened along the way)
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South Dakota

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17 Nov 2006 01:03 PM  
I am curious as to how you ended up getting the pup from Kansas City?  Did someone else have the pup first and then you bought it from them.  I have a pup that came from Sauk River as well and although it did not come from the Featherstorm/Molly litter, it is a descendant of Featherstorm.  I was frustrated at times but it turns out that I was doing something wrong and the pup wasn't.  If the pup is showing a lack of hunting, which I find hard to believe in this breeding, I would say it was something in the early training that took the pup's boldness and enthusiasm towards finding birds away.
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South Dakota

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17 Nov 2006 01:07 PM  
One quick additional note:  As far as pointing, I put some quail out and let the dog find them, as he got close to the birds, I would hold him back a little with the check cord.  Eventually he began to point the birds rather than rush in and try and catch them.  Seems to have worked for my pup, but I am by no means full-time trainer of pointing labs, it is just something that worked for me.
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18 Nov 2006 05:23 AM  
I have a hard time believeing any dog from david mork's line would be anything but a bird finding fool.
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Moundridge Kansas

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28 Nov 2006 09:01 PM  
What have you done previous to the opener. A dog going into it's first bird season should have already seen at least and at a very minimium 20 birds. I would say the dog needs work, and you the trainer need to decide if you can do that or if you need to send him to someone. If you would bring him down here we can take a look at him and put him on some birds, anything to help you and the dog out.
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30 Nov 2006 05:28 AM  
I will tell you one thing Deke is out of Jake and he is a Duck Hunting Pointing fool. On top of that Deke has been breed a few times and all the pups that went to hunting families are extremely happy with the Hunting abilities and trainability of these dogs. One of the females we breed to was not a pointing lab, yet the three males from that litter went to hunting people and they are pointing fools at 8 month's old. Did you put this dog on birds at a young age and have you continued to do so until the dog shows he is a birdy fool. Some dogs need a little more exposure than others. I believe Jake passes on his genetics to his offspring. At least that is what I have seen in every Sauk River dog produced from Jake. I can only comment on what I have seen.
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Stockholm, NJ

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04 Dec 2006 02:01 PM  
And I can vouch for Deke .. when I saw Deke run the first time in his CPR test I said, wow, now there is a dog that hunts and points as well as my own!!!(trust me when I say "that is a tall order" to match :-)

All kidding aside, Deke is a great dog, birdie, and solid on point, despite the fact that his handler and trainer is John !!! LOL (sorry John I couldn't resist)
ALWAYS trust your bird dog!!!
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01 Sep 2010 12:24 PM  
I believe that I may have a true Brother / Litter Mate of your dog.

Ice, was born on 2/11/2006 from Jake and Molly. Ice came from the Breeder. Another Brother of Ice (prior breeding) was described as one of the best dogs the trainer had seen.

Ice was a pointing machine from the day I selected him. I have several pictures of him as a small fuzzball on point.  His point is very elegent tail stright - front paw lifted a part way.

This dog is a hunting / retreiving machine.  Dog trainers have described Ice as being an exceptional dog, one of the best they have seen for some time. 

I have another dog from Jake, he is very good as well, but Ice is simply on an entirely different skill level.  

Ice is a great dog.   Sometimes, it just takes a bit to get the idea that chasing birds is OK and fun.   - It is possible, that your dog may have gotten the message (inadvertantly) that chasing birds is not OK.   These dogs are as smart as they come, and want to please. 

One thing is certain, your dog has the breeding to be an outstanding dog.  Sometimes you need to find a way to bring this out.

Had Ice, been trained differently or had an owner who was serious about competition & field trial work, he would have won numerous awards. He is that good, and your dog could be as well.

Please feel free to email me directly.  

ldPC@comcast.net">OldPC@comcast.net
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SW Iowa

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01 Sep 2010 03:40 PM  
I have a Jake son. Bird drive is through the roof. In fact at times I wish I could tone it down some.   Very strong intense point at an early age.


Make sure the dog has opportunity, the older they are before they get opportunity the more it takes. I AM NOT SAYIN GTHIS IS THE CASE WITH YOU, but one of my pet peeves iss people that put a dog in a kennel, and expect it to automatically "know" how to hunt. Pups come with their parents genetics, not their training..........
Fritz Baier D.C.

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SW Iowa

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01 Sep 2010 03:43 PM  
did not realize I was responding to a 4 year old thread, my bad.... how the heck did that happen?
Fritz Baier D.C.

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02 Sep 2010 08:36 AM  
born2hunt bought 2 of best pointing labs and none of 2 pointed.i was trying to get him to raise PL  labs but he said he took loss so bad on it that he is not interested anymore.
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02 Sep 2010 10:52 AM  

I have two dogs from Saulk River.  Both of them point consistently on almost every bird.   Ice as I described earlier has a very refined - perfect looking point.  No he was not trained to point, he just does it.  Based on his hunting style and range, I had someone work with Ice to hold his point longer, but his point is 100% instinct.   Now he holds point all day long with a woa. OK get it, and he flushes.

Buddy, another dog from Jake, also points.   His point is not as stylish as Ice, in fact many times a person who did not know his style, would not know he was on point.   He simply locks up in what ever position he is in when he gets scent.   He could be walking with his nose down low, then stops & locks up.   No foot raise, no straight tail, he just does not move.  Ice is much easier, foot is up, tail is stright.  See a photo of ice as a puppy (10 Weeks) on point.

In Buddies his first season, he was 15 yrds away from a bird, got scent, and locked up. His rear end was going one direction his head and chest were going in another almost like he was going around a corner.  He waited until I moved closer, turned to straighten out then continued a slow staulk to within a few yards of the bird. He locked up again.   I kicked the grass to flush the bird. - Bird almost took my hat off, ( I missed).  Later, I started training him to flush on command.

Both dogs were exposed to birds when they were young.  In both dogs, the point is 100% instint.   

Two neighbors of my parents also have dogs from Jake.  Both of them say, the same. Best dog they ever had. I can't comment on the pointing (they say the dogs point, but I did not see it).

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02 Sep 2010 02:43 PM  
"but his point is 100% instinct. Now he holds point all day long with a woa."

How long does he hold w/o the 'woa?'

Jere
Owned by: Alma Bottom Smokin' Storm - 'Storm' - avatar and Shadow's Tucker - 'Tuck'
MinnetonkaBlackIceUser is Offline
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19 Sep 2010 08:33 AM  
Before woa training (age 1.5) he would only hold point for around 10 seconds, then launch at the bird. Early (6-10 months) it was only 4 to 5 seconds, it was getting better with age & the nuimber of birds. I let him range out quite a bit, and it may take some time to get into position for a good shot. -That's why I chose to woa train him.

WOA training, good choice / bad choice, I wanted to control when he would flush the bird.

FYI, I made an error on my email account - If anyone wants to email, they can contact me at MY_OLDPC @comcast.net.

I really would like to tack down true siblings of this dog - Sauk River Feather Storm (Jake) X Good Golly Miss Molly II. It appears to be an exceptional breeding & would surely like comments from others.

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